17 October 2004
'Tom Lantos: Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul Wallenberg.'; Tom Lantos was 9 years old.
16 October 2004
"Ted Kennedy" writes:
So only people who've served can comment on the war or be in a government position? Pretty lame argument dude. Kerry is a pussy. http://www.johnfketchup.com
Cryptome: Agreed that military service offers no special qualification for government service, indeed, the authoritarian, heirarchical, murderous military is surely the worst model for governing a democracy. Vets may know this better than anyone, and it is their anti-democratic experience which offers an invaluable counterbalance to those who believe military power is essential for protecting democracy rather than strengthening it with power distributed equally among the citizenry. Those without military experience all too often praise or condemn it -- rather its mythology of vainglory and cruelty -- in ignorance, not understanding until you're shit-showered, day after day, years on end, while being ordered to commit bestiality against grunts like you, all to help safe-area geo-political strategists polish their reps, you underappreciate the freedom to tell commanders "fuck you" and not get jailed or shot. [Cryptome admin: rah-rah teen-age Army grunt, 1953-56; many thanks to the GI Bill for reducing stupidity, a bit.]
15 October 2004
You note that Bob Dole was seriously wounded. In that case I would think similar notations would be appropriate for some others as well. Max Cleland is a triple amputee. Bob Kerrey lost part of one leg below the knee (he was also a Navy Seal). And Daniel Inouye, I believe, lost an arm. I'm not an expert on military medals, but my understanding is that the Purple Heart is given to those who are seriously wounded while serving. If that's true, then the three I've listed above may very well have earned the Purple Heart. Great list!
While its simple to say that Colin Powell is a "Career Army" man, it is more accurate to point out that he was an Army Ranger who served in Vietnam. He received the Bronze Star and a purple heart. Though it should also be pointed out that he is accused of helping to cover up the My Lai massacre and being involved in the Iran-Contra affair.
Jimmy Carter was never actually a submarine commanding officer. He was a submarine officer and a nuclear engineer,but he doesn't ever appear to have held a command. This has been extensively discussed on sci.military.naval. +
14 October 2004. A. writes:
You've listed people who served in the Reserves; you might want to note that Reagan was in the US Army Reserve from 1937 to 1941/2 (it's a bit unclear when he went into the Regular Army); since enlistment was off his own bat, and (as I understand it) before he was declared medically unfit, it carries slightly different implications. The list, otherwise, is educational... the third section more than any. "When you've finished killing Kruger with your mouth", indeed. Thanks for putting it up.
14 October 2004. Thanks to D.
Contributions welcomed, send to firstname.lastname@example.org
A more comprehensive list, perhaps the source of many of the listings below:
Richard Gephardt: Air National Guard, 1965-71.
David Bonior: Staff Sgt., Air Force 1968-72.
Tom Daschle: 1st Lt., Air Force SAC 1969-72.
Al Gore: enlisted Aug. 1969; Vietnam 1971.
Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.
Daniel Inouye: Army 1943-47; Medal of Honor, WWII.
John Kerry: Lt., Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat 3 Purple Hearts.
John Edwards: did not serve.
Charles Rangel: Staff Sgt., Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea.
Max Cleland: Captain, Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam.
Ted Kennedy: Army, 1951-1953.
Tom Harkin: Lt., Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74.
Jack Reed: Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91.
Fritz Hollings: Army officer in WWII, Bronze Star & seven campaign ribbons.
Leonard Boswell: Lt. Col., Army 1956-76; Vietnam, DFCs, Bronze Stars, & Soldier's Medal.
Pete Peterson: Air Force Captain, POW. Purple Heart, Silver Star & Legion of Merit.
Mike Thompson: Staff sergeant, 173rd Airborne, Purple Heart.
Bill McBride: Marine in Vietnam; Bronze Star with Combat V.
Gray Davis: Army Captain, Vietnam, Bronze Star.
Pete Stark: Air Force 1955-57.
Chuck Robb: Vietnam.
Howell Heflin: Silver Star.
George McGovern: Silver Star & DFC during WWII.
Bill Clinton: did not serve.
Jimmy Carter: Seven years US Navy, submarine captain.
Walter Mondale: Army 1951-1953.
John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs & Air Medal with 18 Clusters.
Tom Lantos: Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul Wallenberg.
Wesley Clark: US Army, 1966-2000, West Point, Vietnam, Purple Heart, Silver Star. 4-star general.
John Dingell: WWII vet.
John Conyers: Army 1950-57, Korea.
Michael Moore: did not serve.
Newt Gingrich: did not serve.
Dennis Hastert: did not serve.
Tom Delay: did not serve.
House Whip Roy Blunt: did not serve.
Bill Frist: did not serve.
Rudy Giuliani: did not serve.
George Pataki: did not serve.
Mitch McConnell: did not serve.
Rick Santorum: did not serve.
Trent Lott: did not serve.
Dick Cheney: did not serve ("I had other priorities").
John Ashcroft: did not serve, seven deferments to teach business.
Jeb Bush: did not serve.
Karl Rove: did not serve.
Saxby Chambliss: did not serve ("bad knee"). The man who attacked Max Cleland's patriotism.
Paul Wolfowitz: did not serve.
Vin Weber: did not serve.
Richard Perle: did not serve.
Douglas Feith: did not serve.
Eliot Abrams: did not serve.
Richard Shelby: did not serve.
Jon Kyl: did not serve.
Tim Hutchison: did not serve.
Christopher Cox: did not serve.
Antonin Scalia: did not serve.
Clarence Thomas: did not serve
Don Rumsfeld: Navy, 1954-57, aviator & flight instructor.
Colin Powell: Career Army, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
George W. Bush: Nat'l Guard with questionable record.
Ronald Reagan: served in non-combat role making movies.
Gerald Ford: Navy, WWII.
Phil Gramm: did not serve.
John McCain: Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross.
Bob Dole: Army, WWII, seriously wounded.
Chuck Hagel: two Purple Hearts & a Bronze Star, Vietnam.
Duke Cunningham: nominated for Medal of Honor, Navy Cross, Silver Stars, Air Medals, Purple Hearts.
Jeff Sessions: Army Reserves, 1973-1986.
JC Watts: did not serve.
Lindsey Graham: National Guard lawyer.
G.H.W. Bush: Pilot in WWII. Shot down by the Japanese.
Tom Ridge: Bronze Star for Valor in Vietnam.
Kenneth Starr: did not
Sean Hannity: did not serve.
Rush Limbaugh: did not serve.
Bill O'Reilly: did not serve.
Michael Savage: did not serve.
George Will: did not serve.
Paul Gigot: did not serve.
Bill Bennett: did not serve.
Bill Kristol: did not serve.
Michael Medved: did not serve.